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Runtime: 10:35
0:00 Will the UAW Organize Mercedes’ Alabama Plant?
0:39 Biofuel Companies Upset Over China Cooking Oil Imports
1:10 80% Of U.S. New Car Buyers Interested in an EV
1:58 Used EV Sales Growing in U.S.
2:50 Supplier Work Shortages Hurt Toyota In Mexico
3:39 Renault Bullish on AV Shuttles
4:46 Renault Launches Rafale PHEV With More Power
5:43 VW Introduces New Golf PHEV in EU
6:30 Opel Frontera Starts At €24,000 In Germany
6:56 Great Wall Motor Reveals 8-Cylinder Motorcycle
7:44 Tesla Shifts FSD Data Strategy in China
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This is Autoline Daily, the show dedicated to enthusiasts of the global automotive industry.
WILL THE UAW ORGANIZE MERCEDES’ ALABAMA PLANT?
We’ve got a lot of news to report on, but we won’t know the details of the biggest story of the day until later tonight. That’s because the National Labor Relations Board will count the votes at the Mercedes-Benz plant in Alabama to see if workers there decided to join the union. Everyone in the industry is wondering if the UAW can score another victory after it won at VW’s plant in Chattanooga. So what do you think will happen and we’ll be sure to report the full results on Monday.
BIOFUEL COMPANIES UPSET OVER CHINA COOKING OIL IMPORTS
Say, did you know that the United States is importing oil from China? But it’s not crude oil, it’s cooking oil. And it’s got American farmers really mad. That’s because biofuel companies that make biodiesel from soybean oil and green jet fuel are turning to cheaper Chinese cooking oil instead. Farmers and agriculture groups are calling for tariffs, but the biofuel industry says there’s a shortage of low-carbon feedstocks and it needs that cooking oil right now.
80% OF U.S. NEW CAR BUYERS INTERESTED IN AN EV
One of the arguments against electric cars is that “nobody wants them.” But according to a survey by Cox Automotive, nearly 80% of Americans who buy new cars say they want an EV. Only thing is, they don’t want one right now. They say they’ll be ready to buy one in another three to five years. That means EV sales could really take off at the end of the decade. Two key things from that Cox Automotive survey. Most car buyers aren’t very aware of the incentives that are available to buy EVs. So automakers should really hammer home the incentives that are available in their advertising. The other tidbit from the survey is people are far more likely to be interested in buying an EV if they know someone who already owns one.
USED EV SALES GROWING IN U.S.
While the numbers are still small, used EV sales are rising in the U.S. Last year, used EVs only accounted for 1% of all used sales. But Carvana says used EVs accounted for 4.3% of its sales in the first quarter of this year. And while the gap is still big, the difference between used EV and ICE average sale prices is narrowing. In the first quarter of 2023, the gap was $13,000 but in Q1 of this year, it dropped to $7,000.
SUPPLIER WORK SHORTAGES HURT TOYOTA IN MEXICO
Toyota has been forced to idle production in Mexico several times this year due to worker shortages at suppliers. Reuters reports the automaker shut down production at its plant in Tijuana for a total of 19 days in February and March because it can’t get the parts it needs. That plant builds the Tacoma, which accounted for about 10% of Toyota’s sales in the U.S. last year and is the third best seller in its lineup. Suppliers in Mexico are facing high employee turnover because workers are frequently changing jobs for better paying ones. As a result, production of parts is being impacted due to declining worker skills. Toyota says it’s working with its suppliers to help with the challenges and see what kind of support they need.
RENAULT BULLISH ON AV SHUTTLES
Don’t expect to buy a self-driving Renault vehicle anytime soon. The company says it’s developing Level 2 and 2+, which will provide some hands-free driving in certain areas, but it thinks going to Level 3 will make vehicles cost so much that people won’t buy them and it claims complete autonomy is “unlikely.” However, Renault feels completely different about autonomous public transportation and is going to kick off a Level 4 self-driving shuttle at the French Open tennis tournament on Monday. It’s partnering with WeRide for the trial and the shuttles feature several rows of seating and display screens, but no on-board safety driver. They are, on the other hand, supervised remotely. Renault sees a market for these electric and autonomous mini-buses in Europe. Just in terms of the need for self-driving public transportation, it estimates there’s demand for several thousand mini-buses a year for the next few years, plus more cities in Europe are implementing low-emission zones where gas-burning vehicles have limited access.
RENAULT LAUNCHES RAFALE PHEV WITH MORE POWER
And sticking with Renault, it also revealed details about a new, sportier plug-in hybrid version of the Rafale, which is a brand-new SUV that debuted last year. Called the Rafale E-Tech 4X4 300 hp, I think you can pretty easily guess how much horsepower it has. The setup combines a turbocharged 1.2L 3-cylinder engine with two electric motors; one on the front axle and the other on the rear. Compared to the standard plug-in Rafale, which has 200 horsepower, the 4X4 300 hp will do 0-100 km/h over 2 seconds faster at 6.4 seconds. It also features a 22-kWh battery pack that provides up to 100 kilometers or 62 miles of all-electric range on the WLTP test cycle. No word on pricing but sales kick off in the autumn.
VW INTRODUCES NEW GOLF PHEV IN EU
Speaking of PHEVs, VW is launching the new plug-in hybrid versions of the Golf in Europe. And kind of like Renault, it has a standard and sporty version. Both feature a turbocharged 1.5L engine and electric motor that drive the front wheels. But the standard eHybrid makes about 200 horsepower, while the Golf GTE makes roughly 270 horsepower. At 19.7 kWh, the battery is about double the size of the previous version and provides up to 143 kilometers or 88 miles of range. Orders for both models are open now in Europe. The eHybrid starts at a little over 44,000 euros and the GTE tacks on another 2,500 euros.
OPEL FRONTERA STARTS AT €24,000 IN GERMANY
And while I’m talking about pricing, Opel’s newest electrified SUV, the Frontera, will start at 24,000 euros in Germany, including taxes. That’s for the mild hybrid version with 48-volt technology. But the Frontera shares a platform with the Citroen C3 and like that model, it also comes as a pure battery electric. And that version starts at 29,000 euros.
GREAT WALL MOTOR REVEALS 8-CYLINDER MOTORCYCLE
And now it’s time to get off electrification for a moment and let piston heads rejoice! There’s a brand new 8-cylinder engine hitting the market. But in this case, it’s in a motorcycle. Great Wall Motor is coming out with a touring bike called the Souo, (Soo-oh) which means soul. It has a 2-liter, flat 8, boxer engine, a shaft drive, a cast frame and dual wishbone front suspension. The first V8-powered motorcycle came from a company called Curtiss all the way back in 1906 and only had about 30 or 40 horsepower. But who would have ever guessed that Great Wall, which is known for its off-road SUVs, would make a V8 motorcycle?
TESLA SHIFTS FSD DATA STRATEGY IN CHINA
Tesla is shifting its strategy to collect data in China for its Full Self Driving system. Reuters reports that the company is planning to power the global development of FSD with data from China that would be processed in the country. To help achieve that, Tesla is working on plans to open a data center to train algorithms needed for self-driving cars. But Tesla will have to work with a local Chinese partner to open the data center. Up until now, Tesla was focused on getting approval from Chinese regulators to transfer data created by its vehicles out of the country for its FSD system.
And that brings us to the end of today’s show. Thanks for making Autoline a part of your day and I hope that you have a great weekend.
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That motorcycle with the 180 degree “V8” looks kind of heavy. It probably sounds cool, though. I wonder if they will sell it in the US.
My neighbor has a Cybertruck. I had a ride in it. I felt as if I was in a Start Trek shuttle. The number of apps avaliable is massive. Even an app to make fart sounds in the seats or turn signal. The Frunk is very small. Vision out is limited but cameras cover every view. It is a very large vehicle.
The Souo motorcycle does look heavy, but I suspect the boxer layout means a low center of gravity… so that weight may be manageable.
Great wall’s motorcycle isn’t a V8 but a flat 8. The Honda Goldwing is a flat 6 cyl. with 1832cc so GW adding 2 more cylinders and 168 more cc’s Will be interesting to see how it compares.
Again these studies that show 80% interest in EVs is so misleading. I mean the follow up question of why people would be interested in 5 years and not today would tell you alot. My guess is they assume in 5 years the charging network will be built, charge times will be reasonable, and prices will be comparable. But if those things dont happen will 80% still be interested? I doubt it. So, what was the interest today? Because speculation on a what might happen means nothing. As I am interested in taking a vacation to Bali in the next 5 years too but doesnt mean it will happen.
That motorcycle looks like quite the heavy weight, wow, ridiculous doesn’t begin to describe it.
Toyota’s parts shortages- I ordered a Silverado months ago but delivery constraints on the multiflex gate has held it up enough that I changed the order from a double cab to a crew cab, no constraints on that chassis. Different plant I guess ???
@Lambo – my thoughts also. The amount of times I’ve heard friends say they were going to do – fill in the blank- and not see it happen is a lot. Also you may want one but when you look into the details you may find it doesn’t work for you.
Sean,
A couple of questions. 1. When a hybrid has a turbocharger, would it make sense to include a way for the turbocharger to help charge the battery when it is not being used to give the ICE more power? I mean, the exhaust energy is being wasted when the turbocharger is not in use. Capturing that energy for charging could make the engine run less often. 2. For that Chinese cruiser bike 8 cylinder engine, I’m more interested in the physical size, weight, horsepower and whether it would fit into an Austin Healey Sprite or other vintage English sportscar.
I had an ’82 Gold Wing, when they were still flat fours. I’ve ridden a 1500cc six cylinder Gold Wing, and really liked the smooth engine that was very car-like, being happy at rpm from barely above idle to red line.
There is a V8 powered motorcycle using a Chevy V8, called Boss Hoss. Dry weight is 1000-1100 pounds.
It seems that a lot of people think that fast EV charging everywhere will make them want an EV. Unless public charging becomes cheaper, or gas gets a lot more expensive, an EV would have little, if any operating cost advantage, at least compared to the more efficient gas vehicles, especially hybrids, using public charging.
@Kit, EV charging: like you I don’t see a financial advantage of an EV when it has to be charged at a public charger.
The power generation grid is over 50% idle at night and the utility companies have an interest to offer low rates then to increase the base load over time. That is worth money to them. Those power rates are less than half of the usual utility rates. When buying day-time utility power through a public charging network you pay the higher day-time tariff plus the cost plus profit margin for the charging facility. To me it seems that EVs make financial sense when charging at night, especially charged at home. I don’t see it for the time being making sense when usually charged at a public charger.
Kit, I had a Honda 1800 VTX and rode a friend’s Gold Wing. Both felt heavier than my Harley, mostly due to their higher center of gravity. I loved the VTX’s power, fuel injection, and synchronized brakes… but the Harley build quality, control buttons, and real chrome (much of the VTX chrome was plastic) make it a class above.
Kevin A., I don’t know how the flat 8 from that bike would work in a Sprite or Midget, but I’ve seen pictures of V8 conversions. I think the Buick/Olds/Rover V8 might be most common, but I suppose a Chevy or Ford small block might work, with a lot of work, and probably cutting of sheet metal. V8 conversions would be more common in larger MGBs. Probably a narrow V6, like the GM 60 degree pushrod 2.8-3.9 might be the easiest fit, but those engines were never considered too great.
Drew, I’ve ridden a friend’s VTX1300, I didn’t think it felt too heavy, but current Gold Wings certainly do. The only Harley I’ve ridden was, I think, a 1978. It was a retired police bike and was a “dresser.” It felt lighter than it was, both because of the low CG, and the low seat height, compared to many other bikes. My current bike is a KLR650 which is “heavy for its weight,” because of its being tall.
Go to the Cox Automotive website and go to their About Us link. These clowns are all in on The Message and all of their service offerings clearly depend on it. They have a heavily vested interested in turning around the current EVpocalypse. So one should view any survey they put out as the pure propaganda that it is.
But hey, I hope all of the big OEMs who’ve already flushed billons down the EV drain, and are currently burning even more money trying to rework all of their planning, facilities, and workforces to pivot to hybrids, see this survey. And swallow it hook line and sinker. They can then burn more millions trying to pivot back to pure EV and cruise to bankruptcy when that supposed 80% interest never materializes into sales.
Maybe not 80%, but a lot more Americans should be interested in an EV now, as a commuter car for households with multiple vehicles and home charging available.
@Kit. – I can believe there’s some increase in “interest “ but a lot of that is because it’s pushed so hard in all the media. Being aware of them and liking the idea is a long way from being able to afford one and all the associated costs. The demographic most favorable to them for the most part can’t afford renting apartments, let alone a house and a new car payment. Putting aside ideology, there’s huge economic headwind against adoption that the EV pushers ignore.
Given the number of Benzes, BMWs, Lexii, Acuras, and Infinitis I saw on my 500 mile road trip today, “affordability” is not the detriment to buying EVs, A lot of people just don’t want them.
Look at overall sales of BMW’s, Acura’s, Infinities and Benzes and you’ll quickly realize that still a limited market. What you see on the road in a specific area isn’t a good indicator of anything. Cause if you drive around the Detroit or Dallas area you would think Trucks and full-size SUVs account for 80% of sales. Drive around LA and you’ll assume Toyota has 80% of the car market.
Ask the people around you about their serious interest in an EV and at least for me I don’t know anyone that wants one that can also afford one. The one person I believe would buy one lives in an apartment and she struggles to get by on about 40K a year. She doesn’t know much about the automotive industry and could be swayed more by the color than what is actually a good vehicle.
I mean no disrespect to any EV owners because this isn’t the case for all, but some people will jump on the “new” bandwagon without much thought. Or they hear its good for the environment and are “all in” without clearly thinking things through. Which is why 30% of Tesla owners in California were going back to ICE vehicles after their Tesla ownership. So, while EVs are a great fit for some people and have worked well it does require a change in driving, charging and the way one uses their vehicle. Obviously for some it works great but it’s not for everyone and we all know a few people that are impulsive and can get on-board with movement without knowing all the details. Anyway, I do believe that cost is still a deterrent for many people when it comes to EVs as the thought of buying any new car period is having to be pursued with caution when interest rates are up and the cost of everything has left less money available for luxury items like spending a couple extra grand on that next car purchase. People are cutting back and the sellers of EVs batter be taking notice. When Mc Donalds has to rethink their menu options to go back and offer $5 menu meals you know things are tight. They, like most fast food has priced themselves out of the market. People have realized they can go to a chain like Applebee’s for the same price as fast food. Our national debt just hit 15 trillion so they’ll likely just print more money and inflation is going to get worse. Biden has single handedly pushed an EV agenda and made it unaffordable at the same time. Will then wonder why his plan has failed.
Since you mention it, I saw a lot of pickup trucks and large SUVs while on my trip from Florida to Indiana.
Where did you hear that 30% of Tesla owners in California were going back to ICE vehicles? That sounds high, but whatever the actual number, I suspect it is mostly people in apartments without home charging, and they found that it was neither cheap nor convenient to depend on public charging.
BTW, a Mini is a great road car, for one or two people. The seats are comfortable, it drives well, and gets pretty good gas mileage. The main down side is that it’s kind of noisy, especially on “grainy” pavement. I could improve that with non-run flat tires, but if I did that, I’d probably want a spare.
My mistake it was only 20%.. But if you google Ev owners go back to ICE there are a bunch of reports of this. Here is just one from business insider.
https://www.businessinsider.com/electric-car-owners-switching-gas-charging-a-hassle-study-2021-4
From that article, 70% don’t have level 2 home charging. I suspect a sizable number who swich back to ICE don’t even have level 1. Even at their best, though, EVs are a compromise for long road trips. My recent 1100 mile trip took two short gas stops. The same trip in an EV would have added hours to the trip.
I think that gap between used EVs and ICE vehicles is a flexible thing. From what I’ve seen, the EVs are about the same if only a few years old, but when you get back to the 10-year range, the EVs seem to be cheaper than the ICE vehicles.