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Runtime: 10:21
0:00 BYD Song L Undercuts Tesla Y By $10,000
0:59 Want A Cybertruck? Fork Over $1,000
1:25 GM Cruise Axes 900 Jobs
2:08 GM Layoffs at Orion & Grand River
2:41 Honda To Lease Used Cars
4:30 More “Icks” From Cadillac
5:12 VW ID.2 All, The Beetle of EVs
6:17 Zeekr Launches New LFP Battery
6:57 Mercedes Brings AI into the Cockpit
8:16 MG 5 Gets Crushed in Crash Tests
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This is Autoline Daily, the show dedicated to enthusiasts of the global automotive industry.
BYD SONG UNDERCUTS TESLA Y BY $10,000
It looks like Tesla is going to have to cut the price of its Model Y again in China. That’s because the BYD Song L, which is targeted directly at the Model Y, just debuted with a starting price of $26,700. That’s $10,000 cheaper than a Model Y. The base version of the BYD Song L comes with a 71.8 kWh battery and a 150-kilowatt motor, which is 200 horsepower. BYD already outsells Tesla with pure EVs in China, and this new model will probably increase its sales lead even more. Tesla was the company that kicked off the EV price war in China at the beginning of the year. And now it looks like BYD is giving Tesla a taste of its own medicine.
WANT A CYBERTRUCK? FORK OVER $1,000
Speaking of Tesla, it wants you to fork over a non-refundable $1,000 deposit if you’re serious about buying a Cybertruck. A reported 2 million people paid the refundable $100 deposit to reserve the electric truck, but now Tesla is looking for the more serious buyers. And this is also going to help Tesla gauge what the demand actually is.
GM CRUISE AXES 900 JOBS
GM Cruise keeps making headlines, and for all the wrong reasons. Just weeks ago, the CEO and Chief Product Officer resigned. Two days ago, Cruise fired nine executives. And yesterday, it announced it’s cutting nearly a quarter of its workforce or about 900 jobs. Most of the layoffs are related to corporate functions, not engineering. Cruise lost $700 million in the third quarter and more than $8 billion since 2016. But GM CEO Mary Barra says she still believes that Cruise will ultimately turn the corner and become an extremely profitable business.
GM LAYOFFS AT ORION & GRAND RIVER
GM is also laying off people at two other plants in Michigan. It’s cutting 945 jobs at the Orion plant, which builds the Bolt EV, which is going out of production until 2025. And GM will cut 369 jobs at its Lansing Grand River plant where the Camaro is going out of production. But that plant will continue to build the Cadillac CT4 and CT5. GM will offer the laid off worker’s jobs at other plants as soon as they’re available.
HONDA TO LEASE USED CARS
Honda & Acura just launched a new marketing campaign that we think everyone in the industry is going to copy. They’re offering to lease CPO cars. CPO stands for certified pre-owned. They’re used cars that get inspected, fixed up and sold with a warranty. Honda and Acura are also offering free roadside assistance and cheap 1.49% financing. Except that now, Honda and Acura will lease with the target of first-time, young buyers. Some car dealers have been pleading for years for automakers to provide them with the financing tools to lease used cars. This may be one of the answers to deal with the affordability issue, since car prices skyrocketed because of Covid shutdowns and chip shortages. Though leasing is not a gift to the consumer, it does lower the monthly payments, and in the U.S. market, car buyers pay far more attention to the monthly payments than to the overall price. Automakers have been reluctant to lease used cars because they’re afraid it would cannibalize new car sales. But now that Honda and Acura are doing it, we think everyone else will jump on board.
MORE “ICKS” FROM CADILLAC
There’s a new ‘ick’ coming to Cadillac’s EV lineup. First came the Lyriq, then the Celestiq, then the Escalade IQ, more recently the Optiq and now it’s just revealed the all-new Vistiq. It’s listed as a 2026 model year vehicle, which means the earliest it will come out is sometime in 2025, and when it does, it will slot between the Lyriq and the Escalade IQ. That’s about all we have to go on for now, but Cadillac says we’ll get more details sometime next year.
VW ID.2 ALL, THE BEETLE OF EVs
In March Volkswagen revealed a new entry-level EV concept, called the ID.2all that is a preview of a production car that’s coming out in 2025. Now it’s teasing an SUV version that will come out a year later in 2026. Both models ride on its new MEB Entry platform, which is FWD based. And while VW didn’t share any other details about the SUV, here’s what we can tell you about the car version; it has about the same wheelbase and width as a current Golf, but overall, it’s about 9 inches shorter; it will be powered by a roughly 166 kW or 222 horsepower electric motor, which is enough to power the vehicle from 0-100 km/h in about 7 seconds; and it will have about 450 kilometers or 280 miles of range. VW says the ID.2all SUV is an important step to bringing affordable EVs to the masses.
ZEEKR LAUNCHES NEW LFP BATTERY
Chinese automaker Geely’s premium EV brand, Zeekr, unveiled a fast-charging lithium iron phosphate or LFP battery. Its upcoming 007 sedan, which has an 800-volt architecture, will be the first model to use it. The battery is able to provide 300 miles or 500 kilometers of range in just 15 minutes of charging. The 007 has a 75.6-kWh pack, a motor that produces 310-kW or 415 horsepower, and it provides 688 kilometers or 427 miles of range.
MERCEDES BRINGS AI INTO THE COCKPIT
Virtual assistants are about to get a lot better. It just so happens that I shot a video of myself interacting with Mercedes’ current virtual assistant in a recent test car and Mercedes just showed off a teaser video of its new AI-based virtual assistant that will debut at CES in January. And the difference between the fluidity of speech is really obvious. Here’s me asking the current system a question… and here’s the teaser video of the new system. I know the joke the current car tells is not that great, but I did get a better response off-camera a day earlier, which was, “you can’t trust any atoms because they make everything up.” But with Mercedes’ new AI-based system, which we think uses ChatGPT, interactions should be much more natural.
MG 5 GETS CRUSHED IN CRASH TESTS
SAIC, or the Shanghai Automotive Industry Corporation bought MG in 2007 and has done a terrific job with the brand, especially with exports. So far, this year MG is the Number 6 EV brand in Europe. In the UK it’s Number 2, only behind Tesla. But not all MGs are electric. There are ICE versions too. And in Australia it’s the 7th best-selling brand in the whole market, including all vehicle types. But Australia just crash tested the MG 5 sedan and it failed miserably. The Australian NCAP gave it zero stars. In head-on collisions, off-set, side impact and pole tests, the car did not do well. This comes as something of a shock. Twenty years ago, Chinese cars were famous for folding up in an accident. But that was then. Today, most Chinese cars are well designed to meet crash standards, but clearly the MG 5 was not.
But that brings us to the end of today’s show. Thanks for making Autoline a part of your day and I hope that you have a great weekend.
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Sean, When is GM going to rename the top division Cadill IQ ?
Does anyone know the specific reason for ‘tumblehome’, the tucking in of the car body at the top and bottom? It occurred tome that BEVs could package more batteries if the body was wider at the bottom, like it is on F1 cars.
I wonder if Tesla will reveal how many $1000 deposits it gets. Now we will see what the real interest is, as I always felt the refundable $100 deposits was just Elon’s clever way to manipulate the stock market. Every time they showed the high “interest” in a vehicle with over a million reservations the stock would spike even though the vehicle didn’t launch for years. I for one am really interested to see how many non-refundable deposits they get.
That’s a nice shade of blue on the ID.2 in the video. That car, basically an electric Golf, should do well, if it is any good.
It seems that no “premium” or “luxury” brand wants to use names for cars. It’s either alphanumeric, like the Germans, (except Porsche), or gimmicky like Cadillac’s Ick names. Well, there’s near-premium Lincoln. At least the letter part of the Mercedes monikers sort of make sense, once you have the system memorized. Interestingly, Mercedes work vans have actual names, but no other models do, at least in the US market.
I understand Tesla wanting the $1000 non-refundable deposit to find out how many people actually want to buy the thing, but as a potential buyer, given the slow ramp up, I’d wonder how long, maybe years, I would be giving Elon an interest free loan. I’ll be surprised if we get any real information about how many $1000 deposits come in.
Kevin- I believe that rounded design came about to reduce drag (aerodynamic driven) and also to reduce the rocker ledge needed to clear when getting in and out of the vehicle. If you remember the cars of the 60-70s and how easy it was to get your pants dirty on the rocker panel and now that’s tucked in further making getting in the seat easier. I could be wrong.
I believe “the bloom is off the rose” as far as the cyber truck is concerned. There will certainly be buyers, but the million pre-orders, lost there merit with the delayed introduction and the subsequent price increase. The 1G non-refundable deposit, makes sense for Elon, because the pre-order mis-direction is over.
I remember my dad complaining about his 1971 Plymouth Satellite being “tucked under” at the bottom, because dirt and rocks from the remaining unpaved roads got thrown on the paint, making it look dirty, and worse, making it vulnerable for rock dings that would end up causing rust. I also think that was about the time rain gutters went away on most cars.
And as far as another new model for Cadillac, gee whiz, they have to get a handle on production to see what the real demand is for their cars. I believe sales have been lost when buyers were ready for a Tesla alternative, and Cadillac just couldn’t provide what they so heavily advertised.
I read in Car and Driver, that the Vistiq appears to be a midsize, three row BEV SUV. Yet with the Lyriq already midsize, why would Cadillac/GM double down on another vehicle in that almost identical space? I understand that the public can’t seem to get enough SUVs, but Cadillac has already introduced subcompact, midsize and full size electric SUVs, but no compact! Would it make more since to introduce a compact first, before another midsize?
The one thing I can say about Cadillac and ins sibling brands, GM has done more to demonstrate what it has coming in the next few years then either Ford or Chrysler, relative to EVs! Like them are not, the next few years, GM has built up a lot of exciting future product for those interested in electric vehicles, while Ford and Chrysler have talked about and shown very little of the future passenger vehicles!
The Zeekr 007 looks amazing and I wonder how much and how quickly that will that new battery tech will make its way through other vehicles in the Geely family of vehicles.
It looks like the Optiq will be “compact,” at least smaller than Lyriq.
Yes, Cadillac is releasing a lot of EVs which makes me wonder how the brand will do if ICE bans and EV requirements get pushed back a few years. Cadillac seems pretty bullish on the EV adoption while the rest of GM is taking a more cautious approach. (personally, I think that’s mainly due to the price point GM needs to get for its EVs and no because they want Caddy to have so many EVs). So, if sales of EVs continue to cool or worse flatten where will that leave Cadillac?
I didnt find the Zeekr to be anything exciting. The design, much like todays CUV’s looks pretty much like any other 4 door sedan. Even the VW ID2 with its cleaner lines just looks like a freshened Golf.
We are hearing the death rattles of GM Cruise and perhaps its biggest fan, Mary Barra. This is a market that has never made any sense to me. Taxi and Uber drivers just don’t make much money. Many cabs are driven for over 20 hours a day with platooning drivers. A Cruise taxi would cost well over $100,000 more than a regular cab. So how does the economics work out? Saving the salary of the driver is not enough.
Since the New Bolt will not come out until 2025, why stop production of the current Bolt at the end of the year? I can only think of 2 reasons. The current battery/pack is proving to be too costly/difficult to make or some new safety requirement needs to be designed/engineered in the current car and it’s too costly for only one year of sales.
@1214 Tumblehome is only the curving in at the top, and it is for styling/aesthetics. Ever see a van that has almost no tumblehome? Pretty ugly.
I’m guessing they are losing money on the current Bolt at current prices, and that is why it is going away.
It seems like Cadillac is introducing a lot of electric CUVs, when they are having trouble producing even one. If none of them sell, they have the Escalade to fall back on. They had better keep one or two of the current CUVs around. XT5 is currently their second best selling vehicle after Escalade, so they should keep it. They sold 27,340 in 2022.
Porsche is introducing an electric Macan next year, but I’ve read that they will keep selling the gas one, as long as there is a market. I’ve also read that they will keep the gas Boxster and Cayman at least a year or two after they introduce the electric 718s in 2025.
I watched (barely) the Autoline After Hours yesterday and couldn’t believe how off sync the sound was to the picture, doesn’t anybody check stuff like that anymore, it almost made it unwatchable, I pretty much looked out my window while I listened to it so I wouldn’t get too pissed off at the lack of sync. Geez.
Another great week of autoline,thanks
Albemarle- I never quite understood GM wanting to get into mobility service either. But then it dawned on me that the only other option would be to just build the cars and let another company like Uber or Lift run them and without any control on how the tech was used or the knowledge that was gained from them. Yet still have all the legal liabilities fall on them. Face it, This tech is still in development stage and GM needs to hold the reins before releasing it to the public. I really think the revenue stream they’re counting on will come from selling the AV software in future cars not actually in a taxi service. I agree that the cost of an actual fare that would cover running Cruise cars around would make them non-competitive. Cruise might make a solid business case in the future for large cities but I’m afraid it might cost GM and Barra dearly before it can prove itself.
GM should sell Cruise, if it has any value. If it has no value, maybe they should just shut it down, and try to fix the production hell they are having with those EVs.
Even GM has limits to their resources. By selling Cruise they could get back to the core of the business sooner.
The MG5 could be the first misstep by the Chinese iteration of MG. I thought by now the Chinese makers would have learnt that Australians do not like cheap as chips cars with 0 ANCAP test results as much as they hated finding asbestos in the engine compartment of their new car 20 years ago.
By comparison, the MG4 is getting rave reviews as it did when released in Britain and New Zealand.
The MGs that passed the European and British tests were undoubtedly made to pass the tests. All auto makers make lower safety models for countries that don’t have standards. The Chinese just blew it by sending the wrong spec cars to Australia. Good for them being caught.
Kit — Car and Driver in December 14, 2023 report of the Vistiq, while describing the Cadillac EV future lineup, said that the Optiq was sub compact. While introducing it in China, when it gets to (should it come to) the US and other markets, we’ll have to wait and see where it falls and what class it occupies.
Lambo — Personal, I believe your right with Cadillac/GM on their EV approach, with cost being a big factor with Cadillac’s BEV strategy. Even if the ICE bans are pushed back, people ARE buying/leasing EVs, just look and Tesla, Rivian and Lucid. Where Cadillac plans to price their EVs, they are among the price points of the startups. When you also consider the fact that they have the backing of an established legacy OEM, with a perceived initial quality and that might be enough for a potential customer to consider them! Plus, Cadillac sells aren’t setting the world on fire, so a line up of impressive EVs might convince consumers to consider them on their shopping list.
I’m beginning to think alphanumeric names aren’t so bad after all. We have Lyriq, Optiq, Septiq, Celtiq, Cubiq, whatever. There’s no logic as to which is bigger, and the names aren’t that memorable. CE1, CE2, CE3, etc. would be much more logical, if the numbers go up by size of vehicle. They could make an exception by using CEE for Cadillac Electric Escalade.
Kit, I watched that youtube comparison of Stellantis’ new I6 and outgoing V8 a while back. Still interested in the rationale. Going to an inline 3-liter six is a massive shrink in displacement, while fuel consumption and low-end torque still get an upgrade. Still a pretty agreeable way of replacing an iconic engine format – what Buick could have done a generation ago. And gm even had the modern Atlas to pair it with.
The Zeekr 007 looks good. No faux plastic grill there, Cadillaq. Tesla lost that years ago.
As for widely attainable electric qars, BYD is clearly gearing up for a win in the heart of the market with those 70kWh at way under 30K, in a right-sized CUV. 3 and 4-ton monsters have been an enormous distraction to classic US manufacturers.
The Cruise hard- and software combo actually works pretty darn well. I’m glad that the problem-solvers aren’t being fired. With the cost of sensors only falling, sooner or later autonomous driving will begin to make inroads (heh). As for a return on investment, who can tell? So much depends on the competition and market-specific rulemaking. But handle this episode badly, and many of the coders/engineers will jump ship.
I’m surprised that the lower powered, 420hp version of the Jeep six is a regular gas burner. It would be running quite a bit of boost to get that power from 3.0 litres. Even the 510hp version is premium “recommended,” not required.
https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find.do?action=sbs&id=45847&id=46241&id=45844
That engine seems to work well. Hopefully, it will be reliable.
A few days ago I walked through a Mercedes store. They had a few assorted EQs, and I was not impressed with the appearance of the faux plastic grills. They probably have nice interiors, but seem grossly overpriced, ~$75K base for an EQE sedan, about $22.5K more than a BMW i4.
They should keep making the current Challenger, and put that six in it. It would perform well, and get at least a little better mpg than the 5.7 V8, and a lot better than the 6.4.
I just read that the last Chrysler 300 was built December 9, and the Brampton plant will “close for retooling” January 1. Truly the end of an era, no more Dodge or Chrysler cars of any kind. Apparently Brampton will build the next generation Jeep Compass, and the rumored upcoming electric Charger/Challenger replacement will be built in Windsor, Ontario, along with Pacifica.
Kit- I’m not really surprised that the 3L doesn’t require premium fuel. They have the technology and sensors now to modify the timing and fuel mixture enough to accommodate regular vs premium. Octane sensors and knock sensors can lean or richen it up to use regular fuel. Maybe not get the 420HP but if you’re okay dropping some HP to be able to use regular fuel and its nice to have that option. Not sure why all manufacturers dont do this? They might struggle with emissions using the lower octanes. If they can offer a timing map for the range they should.
Not the last Dodge or Chrysler car. Just the last ICE cars. So, the last ones I will ever buy.
Kit- all the articles I see show all three (Challenger, Charger and 300) being built until this week Dec 22.
But maybe the last 300 was built. The last Camaro was built Nov 22 so its pretty sad to think the only ICE American Sportscars left are Corvette and Mustang for now.
It seems that European, and to a lesser extent, Asian car companies specify premium fuel more than north American companies. BMW has the technology to prevent damage to the mildly tuned 189hp 2 liter turbo in my Mini, “recommending,” not “requiring” premium, but why do they specify premium at all, when Ford specifies regular for their 250hp 2 liter turbo which would be running more boost? I use only regular in the Mini. I use premium in the 300hp 2 liter turbo in the Cayman, which officially, and probably with good reason, “requires” premium.
Toyota is especially strange about what they specify. They specify regular for the 2.4 turbo in a Highlander, but premium for the same engine in a Lexus RX. They must think people who buy the “premium” brand car want to, or don’t mind paying 25-30% more for gas than people who buy a Toyota.
With the Chrysler LX cars gone, the only American brand cars, period, will be Mustang, Corvette, and Malibu. When will the electric Charger arrive? A year from now, or maybe longer? I haven’t heard much about it.